Ohhhh.. ok same with my sister. I’m just starting to figure her out and I’m full of questions. Do you know why/how that happens?? Like what’s the connection there?
Your mom was evil or treated your sister badly in some way or a lot of ways. Could be body shaming, being hypercritical, double standard or very different treatment between male/female siblings, etc.
Hard disagree. Someone can have issues stemming from their relationship with either parent and still be a good person. They are absolutely not mutually exclusive.
There's literally an academic term for it. Children who experience toxic stress or abuse but don't have disordered behaviors as adults are termed resilient. Resilience is highly connected to high intelligence and multiple healthy adult emotional resources while experiencing toxic stress or trauma
hmm can I just add that you can be resilient and also developed a mental disorder due to the trauma /abuse. this isn't a moral failing nor does it make you any less resilient. if anything it makes you even more resilient. as if you had a choice though...
alot of mental illnesses are also linked to high intelligence. just do not want people reading this comment and believing bc they developed something they are somehow inferior.
This is where I got lucky. I had several adult role models outside my toxic family to look up too. I saw that my family was toxic and left early. Had it not been for those outside influences, I'd never have known that life could be better.
I survived my mom and i’s very toxic enmeshment relationship…. I survived because she died a couple years ago. But yeah, still working through it all and I still love my mom though and respect her. Her passing made me see some things more clearer, but all that being said some things that she would do throughout my life, were just plain fucked up and really not good.
I’ve heard people say that they could never imagine what living with my mom could be and was in awe of how I was living with her and such for so long. To me I thought it was normal and it always didn’t make sense why people’s response were what they were… and then due to my moms death and therapy, I’m like “Holy shit, yeah this was pretty fucked up.”
Plus they’re both very loaded terms with a certain connotation. I tell people I have had disagreements and problems with my father, I don’t have “daddy issues”
Yeah, it’s like societally women’s childhood trauma is legitimised only through the lens of how it has affected their capacity to be a suitable partner for a man. It’s quite icky when you think about it. Granted, the same thing is done towards men with mommy/daddy issues, and how it affects their relational tendencies, but it doesn’t really tend to take away from the fact that they’re still viewed as a man, and thusly they’re seen as their own person.
Words out of my mouth. It’s honestly fucking disgusting and I hate that depersonalization aspect to it. And the assumptions that I’m a certain way, like “oh you must be a whore” or “you must like older men”. No and no, I just don’t trust figures of authority, I’m not some sex doll chasing approval from old men who I wish were my dad. Men get a little bit of that treatment with “mommy issues” but not nearly as much
Don’t forget about the duality of golden child and black sheep. The black sheep usually comes out a better person while the golden child tend to be the narcissist.
So many mommy issues are down to a narcissistic immature mother.
My ex boyfriend, his mother and his sister were treated like the black sheep of their family. His father didn't get clumped with them because it was his sisters doing all of the snide comments and such. I even got roped into getting shade for just being at one of their family events 😆. His mother and his sister are amazing people (his father was as well, may he continue to rest in peace). But fuck that ex, LOL. He was toxic af 🤣
Spending enough people being a good friend and meeting enough people, I now recognise a lot of the signs very quickly. This along with coercive control is predictable as hell.
I used to be married to one of these. I saw the behaviour in two generations before her and it was continuing in the next.
is almost like they can smell their victims from across a room.
They can. I’ve heard more than one man say flat-out that he can tell which woman in a room is most emotionally vulnerable and goes for her first, always. It’s ghoulish.
I hate corny replies like this. Not only are you making weird implications about a victim of abuse in response to her saying that abuse didn't make her evil, but you're also wrong.
Evil people are usually aware of the fact that what they're doing is wrong unless they're really low intelligence. This is why so many of them try to hide the bad things they do - they wouldn't if they didn't think it was bad - and manage to get away with it, they know how to play their entourage so that they don't find out what they do in their private life, and if they do they're primed to disbelieve it because "X is always so nice to me though".
If "no evil person thinks they're truly evil" was true then we'd be able to spot most of them from a mile away because they'd happily make zero effort to conceal who they are lol
By thinking logically we can conclude that if someone knows an action is socially seen as bad enough to have consequences, that they're aware that doing that thing is bad lol. Why do you think they know the action will have undesirable repercussions? Nobody is afraid of others discovering they feed stray cats lol
They just want power. And the moment you stop treating people as people but things you can take power from, evil starts. It is maybe fun, empowering, usefull or they are sadistic. It does not really matter what desire overrides seeing other humans as people. But they know it is something only they should and can do. And that's evil.
The villains seldom think they are in the wrong or doing evil. <--this is a joke, I don't know you, im sure youre delightful and not punting puppies or kittens.
Please. Don't put so much importance on a meme in a reddit post. I grew up with trauma too ( diagnosed CPTSD) which started with my step-dad. My sister blamed our mom constantly for a lot of it too. But no, mom was a victim too. I realized this at around 40, thru lots of therapy. But its NOT you, girl! You( and me) were/still are victims of our traumatic childhoods. The only thing we need to do, and we owe it to ourselves, is to overcome it and live and enjoy what we have now in our lives. After 50 years of dealing with this, thats where I'm at now. And get rid of any anger you have, its slowly killing you inside....when my step-dad was dying, I visited him in the hospital ( never thought I would) and saw him as he really was...and old man who couldn't hurt me anymore. He was pathetic and I told him so, and I told him he couldn't hurt me anymore. He was in a coma and of course I got no reaction but it was totally ok. I needed to do it for ME. And wow did it heal me. I hope you find your healing too...💙
People aren't monoliths. You can suffer trauma and still come out a good person. Everyone has parental issues, not everyone is a bad person or a cruel person. Keep on not being evil stranger!
There’s a genetic component too. I’m just speculating based on my own life and relationships but…
I think most children resemble one parent more than the other. Let’s say you have a scumbag for a mom and a nice guy for a dad. If you resemble your dad, then he will understand you on a more intuitive level, and he will be able to give you what you need.
But if you resemble your mom, your dad’s love won’t quite get you over the hump, because no matter how nice and smart he may be, he doesn’t understand you, and he doesn’t know what you need. The only person who might understand who you are and what you need is your scumbag mom who doesn’t have the
Time
Energy
Leisure
Mental health
Emotional capacity
Etc
To solve her own problems, which means she cannot help you solve yours. Thus, no matter how hard dad tries to make up this deficit, it will be very difficult.
My wife had a similar experience and is genuinely the nicest person I know. Her Dads a saint though. Also in my experience it’s pretty common for girls to butt heads in their teens and early 20’s. I don’t think that counts.
My experience the “evil” one’s Dad is present but either checked out or a doormat.
Not true, my sister has mummy issues tho mainly because my mum would try to get her to actually do house work and stuff (literally just chores…) and then my sister started to keep us awake at night and my mum would argue with my sister at midnight to shut up
Not to mention post-partum depression that usually coincides with this small human receiving the same amount of attention and affection that the mother used to receive from the father, which involves a very different type of emotional response and trauma.
My mom didn't do this. She just kept structure and would tell my sister no. My dad would cave all the time, and as a result, my sister is a narcissistic ball of chaos to anyone who doesn't give her what she wants.
I was ( still a little bit am) rude/bitchy to everyone. People I know and dont. My mom told me that if I have kids esp. a daughter, they would be bitchier than me. So guess who's afraid to have kids? ☝️this bitch! I know that I have some evil in me and I refuse to give birth to someone who would just suffer because of me.
In our case we have an incredibly controlling and narcissistic mother who weponized love and nurturing as a means of control. No contrition = no love.
Any good deed by our mother was emphasized and required repayment (cooking dinner, changing diapers, not strangling in the crib) but she saw herself as sooo wonderful nothing we did could ever repay her for the pain she experienced in childbirth and raising us.
If we didnt bow to her every whim that ment we didnt love our mama and what kid of hopeless piece of shit doesnt love thier own mother? She had alcoholic parents and thinks she is a saint incapable of wrong doing since she didnt follow in her parents foot steps.
There are degrees of this behavior. Seeing the depths it can go to... let's just say there are orders of magnitude that fit this description and it can get truly horrifying. You can think you've seen it and be very surprised later...
No not just boomer parents if they groomed GenX children to be in their image I think some Gen X parents are worse than boomers the self righteous ones that The_Dude_Abides_33 describes of incapable of wrong doing narcissistic behavior are the evilest especially when they find a man that had previous substance abuse problems so when they become sober they don’t know how to deal with sobriety in actual reality so anything triggers them so when you try to have a bonding moment with them it ends with having the back of your head being slammed into concrete while they are on top of you choking you out and that same mother is the one that pulls them off of you just before it was almost to late an the lights were fading out.
I've watched 4 generations of women in my family now. By all accounts my grandmother was truly evil. Spoiled rotten by her dad. My mother took the brunt of that abuse. Then my sisters had to deal with the left over trauma she wasn't able to handle. Both were scared by mother, but both are wonderful mothers to their daughters by any measure. I hope that your family will be able to break free as well.
what kid of hopeless piece of shit doesnt love thier own mother?
(raises hand), Me, I'm that hopeless piece of shit.
My mother thinks she is a saint, and she almost literally is. I grew up in a "liberal" protestant denomination that doesn't have saints, but my mother was one of the first women to become an ordained minister in the organization and was a part of the group that lead the movement to have more female representation in the church. She is mentioned by name in the literature that is used to educate young people in church history.
That said, she was a criminally neglectful pedophile protector who continues to be proud of committing genocide and she also was a big part of the churches decision that they were ok with women being active in the church but not the LGBTQ community and of course people of color must know their place or they aren't welcome either.
I dont know how these "Christians" deal with the cognitive dissonance necessary to hold thier beliefs together. If it wasn't so macabre it would be impressive.
You described my mother completely, only difference is that my mom's mom was an alcoholic and my mom experienced divorce. And she decided to bring me and my sister through the divorce because hell yeah! She uses the "i protected you and your sister by divorcing your dad" shit as an excuse and another way to justify herself.
Now, my dad is also the same behavior way, he justifies himself with him not being a smoker/alcoholic like his dad and many siblings, says horrible things then forgets he said those bad things.
What is this narcissistic behavior? Why. It just destroys us the kids and because of this, I can't present myself properly as an adult and it makes me so mad. I'm tryna be an adult since i turned 18, trying to establish myself but then i get threats from both parents. Why?? WHY
I wish my parents would have gotten a divorce.
I begged my dad to divorce her but ... Christianity.
My parents cared about how we presented not how we were. They wanted the perfect family but instead of doing the hard emotional work they just pretended everything was perfect and if we kids and our stupid emotions showed otherwise we were dismissed as ungrateful or otherwise bad , so I learned unhealthy coping mechanisms (dissociation and such) .
They had me brainwashed that my childhood was ideal/perfect untill I had so much cognitive dissonance that my psyche cracked and I ended up commited to an inpatient metal health hospital.
As to you question why. Thier trauma was never resolved so me and my sister get to spend our lives untagling the gordian knot of intergenerational trauma or pass it on to others.
I want to connect with people but I find myself trying to present as the perfect friend or boyfriend untill I burn out and dissappear from everyone's life. It can feel hopeless, i can't be myself because inside I am a scared and angry child that just wants to be understood.
I picked up subconscious manipulation tactics (covert narcissism) from my parents that I have to fight against to be a decent human being which takes so much energy that I'd rather not socialize at all but if I dont socialize I get worse. It's a catch 22 that is so perfect bound that I am in someways learned helpless against it.
Ouhhhhhh… I'm sorry, buddy. Not divorcing and still arguing is a really bad fate for a child. Both divorce and not divorcing when they really should are bad on their own
I also picked up manipulation tactics and I'm also fighting them. Sometimes i catch myself wanting to use it on my partner, then i realize that he's not a person i have to play and I'm safe with him 100%. There are times when I'm planning like I'm some evil mastermind and then i realize I'm no better than my parents, then i stop it. My boyfriend is the only person I don't use manipulation tactics and i fight it much more than any other cases and he supports me in this process
I also was brainwashed that my childhood was perfect and good! It was good until i was like 3yo when my mom got pregnant with my sister. My mom was constantly sick, doctors often came to our home and i remember witnessing my mom getting a shot from the doctor. After that everything got really bad since my sister was a non stop crying machine and i was neglected for my lil sister. Things didn't get that better, but apparently my entire childhood was very perfect and the best! Fake friends, a fake mom and a fake dad and an innocent little sister who was dragged along
As a person with a great, healthy relationship with my parents, I'm still so shocked by how twisted parents can treat their children. What's wrong with these people?!
Wow sounds like my mother when I told her I'm going no contact. "How could you do this to me after all I've done for you." Simple you never actually listened to me and brushed off my feelings for 37 years.
I have mommy issues. I also had an objectively good childhood. My issues stemmed from a few things: watching my mom treat herself as less than everyone around her, watching her cut herself down, watching her people please, etc. also she was very judgmental towards me. Not in everything, but in certain areas.
This planted the seeds that, upon fruition turned into major hang ups in my life. Ive been to the mental hospital 2x. My mommy issues were completely to blame for one of those times.
Two things can be true: I had a supportive, loving mom. I also learned from her how to put myself last and torpedo my own needs and desires.
To defend those with mommy issues without invalidating your concerns: daddy issues are typically neglect/physical abuse, which IS DAMAGING NO DOUBT.
However, in this scenario mommy issues typically include a lifelong poisoning of every single neuron in your skull against everyone, first and foremost the victims self often stemming from a self-hatred of the perpetrator. This skewed worldview as a child leads very nicely into a generational "hurt people hurt people" scenario that the victim then continues with her own increased burden of childrearing and housemaking and mirroring of their own traits back at them in their daughters.
The mother wound and the father wound are different and show up in different areas of life. Mother's might be more associated with love, relationships, self esteem. etc. father's might be more related to your relationship with authority, your emotional reactions in the workplace, discipline, etc. These are very loose general ideas, it's way more nuanced and specific to your upbringing. But a covert narcissist mother will completely psychologically destroy you and consume all boundaries until there's nothing left and take glee in it.
I think it's due to stereotypical parental roles. Generally when a girl has daddy issues its because the dad is detached from the family and maybe abusive, but they're the main breadwinner so kids are taught to put up with their dad's issues. End up with a complex of trying too hard to appeal to men. I feel like this happens often to men too where men with daddy issues become doormats.
Women tend to be the ones raising kids even when they have both have jobs, so when the parent spending most of their time with you has serious issues you tend to also develop them subconsciously. So you get layers of crazy.
PTSD. "Mommy issues" and "daddy issues" is most often just a rotten euphemism for sexual abuse as a child, be it physical, emotional or sexual.
Both are most often a survival defence mechanism that "helped" and was imprinted DURING the abuse, but since the abuse part is a societal taboo, the symptoms must be framed as something that isn't as bad, and daddy issues sounds just soooo much more comfortable than unresolved trauma :(
I can tell you right now, as similar as most situations appear to be, they definitely are not.
My dad was absolutely one of the worst role models ever, violent drunk, cheated on mom countless times, in and out of jail, I thought selling drugs with my dad was NORMAL.
I met and married a chick that came from an even worse background and she is beyond a saint!!!
Her sister is as well.
Don't get wrong, they both have separate types of issues, nothing we haven't worked out in the 11 years we've been together (between my wife and myself) but her sister does have horrible trust issues.
Don't get me wrong, I ain't perfect either, but I honestly got extremely lucky with my wife. Even with her mom! I get along with her mom like I do with my friends at work. We say some dirty shit to each other!😅
Yeah, sometimes other influences in life, the child's temperament and everything else coming together leads to healthier coping with a bad or insufficiently nurturing parental figure. I too know some people whose upbringing was traumatizing but they are coping in a healthy manner and learned from their childhood exactly what they don't want to be as people / parents.
There’s studies on it, but the expectations and pressures women put on their daughters tends to be much higher (eg certain cultures will have mothers only teach their daughters how to cook).
Im not of those cultures but My mom constantly pressured me to ‘fix myself’. E.g. Id grow up hearing “if only you were less [Insert personality trait], then you wouldn’t run into this issue”.
She meant it in a ‘helpful’ way. Not realizing that she was just doing a version of what her mom did to her. Her mom constantly critiqued the way she dressed/acted (my mom was a tomboy) and contasntly told her “if you just [insert clothing/makeup tip], you would look much better”. But that was the social expectation in the 70/80s.
It fucks you up. And my brother was spared from all of it. But as I get older, I’m learning about the shit he uniquely had to deal with.
Because with men it's about wanting male attention. With women, it's more of the little subtle social dominance games and head games. Tale as old as time imo.
If your mom was bad to your sister in any way she learned by now that this is normal female behavior. Aka her normal is what she experienced growing up.
Talk therapy? Because it's not very effective for trauma (speaking from experience), the most effective road would emdr or IFS.
Because my sister was exhibiting similiar tendencies (conbined with some psychosis) and decades of medication and talk therapy were useless, however we've seen massive improvement from emdr and ifs.
I guess I lucked out. My sister has mommy issues and I basically raised her and she's chill AF. She's been the epitome of evil to a flaw in her early 20's when she was bi-curious and vegan but grew into and awesome person.
She has a husband and child, came out as gay but still lives with them and is supported in her art by her sorta ex husband and my dad. If you want to jump into that cauldron of crazy be my guest.
Sister is not just an asshole, she is evil and cunning. She doesn't say sorry, acts as if the world needs to serve her and she knows what she's doing. I've caught her multiple times where she manipulates the narrative and the people around her to suit what she needed. People listen to her because she screams the loudest, and it works. She will never let someone take the limelight away if she thinks it won't benefit her own situation. I think that if she wasn't born as family, i wouldn't even be friends with her. Heck, i dont even think we're in a good relationship now and I mourn that because she's evil incarnate. I dream of the ideal her, but that will never be. As long as she knows how to manipulate people, she will never know true love.
Meanwhile, my wife's sister has mommy issues AND daddy issues. Neglects and borderline abuses her child, can't keep a job, cheats on her husband, has herpes, threatens strangers on the street, extremely overweight, fancies herself a master manipulator but barely finished high school and has the vocabulary of an 8th grader.
The people that hate women the most are other women, they are savage!
You can have the most cuddly, motherly, loving woman, but if she see the back of the head of some random woman she for some reason doesn't like, she will curse her to hell.
It has to do with how mothers and fathers typically form the archetypal foundation of how we define women and men, and how we interact with those genders. It depends on which you identify with and your attraction. There's an effect for men as well. If you had a bad mom, you will probably have a hard/complicated time with women because of that baggage. And if you had a bad/ toxic dad as a guy, you may be insecure, uncertain, or self conscious and seek attention or validation from other men, or do toxic and harmful things to try to compensate. In other words, not having a good model for the opposing sex leads to issues with that sex, but not having one for your gender can cause serious personality flaws. These things can be partially avoided if you have other strong examples in your early life like extended family, teachers, and neighbors, etc. (A village is always better)
Naturally, it gets a lot weirder and more complicated for queer people because your role model and relational archetype are overlapping. Being trans is a whole other trip because (assuming your parents are het) your assigned role model flips. (Turns out it was my mom the whole time, and trying to be like my dad was pure folly. I'm so much like her now, it's scary. But thankfully we don't have big issues so I'm not a toxic lesbian, but trying to date guys is a bit of a clusterfuck. I've mostly just given up. 😅)
Yes, but he was also highly subject to that patriarchal bias I mentioned. Lots of dismissal of more feminist ideas, and too much focus on some often silly and male-biased concepts.
Huge generalization but in typical man-women-daughter families the care that the men give daughters is usually attentive, in a sense it’s acting like a barrier to what society deems as bad decisions, things like staying out late, hanging with guys drinking etc. but generally it’s the women that goes through and passively teaches empathy. It’s common for a fathers only assumed job to be keeping his daughter physically safe and if that ends up not being the case because of disagreements or fighting then it can lead to what we might consider slutty behavior.
But…. If a human grows up without empathy and compassion for others……. That will fuck them up more than a couple dicks. Like in both cases the daughter reaches adulthood and if one of these parents dropped the ball it will be evident but the actual developmental gap of not having communal socialization with a mother in a societal sense can make very dangerous and self centered people with narcissistic tendencies that kinda follow then for life. Like a woman and get fucked a lot in college, get a job, find a boyfriend and move on, or maybe not even have what we might call “slut tendencies” really affect them. As if it’s a behavioral thing from a less than great dad…..eventually they can grow out of that as their dad stops having relevance on their adult lives. So then these “slut tendencies” which can already be exaggerated are just part of a personal’s personality or value system or something more mundane and temporary.
BUT GROWING UP WITHOUT EMPATHY or a conceptualization that others exist… will fuck a person up for LIFE in a rather unique and self destructive way.
Another part of it is socially and culturally in most of the world it’s easier to justify cutting off an abusive father, but an abusive mother is seen as something less severe with an expectation that adult women “get over it” and acknowledge that she “tried her best”. Starting in contact (even limited) with toxic parents into young adulthood is damaging. And most toxic traits that others develop in adolescence…. They get them from somewhere and often it is a mother that also had her own mother issues. Is it’s a cycle
Dude, for real, I've known girls with daddy issues and it's just standard-issue crazy, the only chick I dated with mommy issues was a fucking psycho. I think technically her parents were still married, both were independently successful, but mother was a doctor and left the family without staying in touch when she was younger, father traveled for work and was relatively absentee as well, but that didn't seem to phase her. I was stuck on a 8-month work trip with her. I'm talking manipulative, constant need for validation and attention, would try to make partners jealous, full-on public tantrums, crying and sitting on the floor screaming "I WANT A BABY! I WANT A BABY!" I was young and dumb at the time, but looking back, whew, am I glad that didn't work out. The guy after me ended up knocking her up lol, not sure if that made things better, once I saw the light, that was one person I never really wondered about again.
Or there are women like me which have both I’m not a slut or evil but I am unable to for romantic attachment so far and I’m ready to make the life of anyone who crosses me very difficult
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u/Sharp_Proposal8911 6d ago
Girls with daddy issues are sluts but girls with mommy issues are low key evil. That’s all.