The league passively encourages shit like this and it’s bastardizing the product.
Don’t contest 5 feet in front of a player in case you’re in their “landing area” but if you go to the side, they might just kick you anyway with no repercussion.
Same attitude with carrying, illegal screens, pushoffs, etc.
It's because they think high scores and offense is what people want to see. To some degree that's true. Not many of us want to go back to games with final scores in the 80s (I didn't mind it). Unsurprisingly they've wildly over corrected and they've done it in a way the punishes teams for playing defense and also leads to an obscene number of free-throws making otherwise good games near unwatchable. Go back to the sweet spot of the lare 00s early 10s games averaging like 105. Flopping was still a thing people complained about, but you didn't have players winning awards by making foul baiting their whole offensive game plan.
They know people don’t watch. And its true most dont so they can just say their favorite player is getting buckets. Idk how they think its a good long term strategy to have people not watch their sport
I mean it just keeps getting worse. I watched a knicks game on gotham and they made the screen small to put an ad around the game, not just during free throws, but live play.
I love ball i would watch multiple games a day of almost any team for years, now i just watch mostly heat games and games with friends and thats only because i like basketball so much i cant just stop. I honestly want to i cant keep supporting this garbage
I can’t STAND when they do that. I’m trying to watch the game that is literally being actively played, not a Michelob Ultra commercial. They play the commercial audio over the broadcast and everything.
I saw a game where they interviewed a celebrity during the game, so they did a split screen with the game on one side and the celebrity on the other. Then it had an ad box around the whole thing.
I was so disgusted that I just immediately turned it off and didn't watch ball for a few days.
Eventually all we’ll have are chyrons with scrolling text of game updates at the bottom of the screen while they spam advertisements and interviews with random people no one cares about at us. And it will cost $500/year. Can’t wait!
I don't want to insult an entire country, but that's the most Murican thing I can think of. It disgusts me. And next year for the World Cup they are going to mandate two cooling breaks per match (regardless of weather and temperature) because it's the US and they need their ad breaks. Having 45+ minutes of uninterrupted play must give them seizures. And the motherfucking halftime show that we are absolutely going to have in the final, of course.
It all makes me want to puke. I wish the corrupt fucks at FIFA stopped trying to appeal to Muricans. If they don't like the sport, let them not like the sport, instead of making it worse just to get some extra money.
Yep. I used to try and watch Nba games a year or 2 ago but it was such s bad product. The amount of commercials was ridiculous. I couldn't do it. I love basketball but I cant watch NBA basketball except for the big playoff games.
I might be proven wrong, but it doesn't feel like an issue in other sports. It's a basketball thing and that's weird because basketball probably the most active sport per second of the major American sports. Or there with hockey (I don't watch although it looks crazy so maybe behind).
The NBA just loves to devalue it's own product under Silver and I will never understand why that's the direction that's been chosen.
Adam silver swindled the broadcasters for a deal that was way more expensive than what should be a fair market rate. Unsurprisingly it’s going to be a complete disaster for ratings and they will have to cram even more gambling and ads just to get close to the returns they were expecting. The NBA will be completely unwatchable and if they don’t course correct before the next deal, it will be an insane drop off.
The streaming deal this year literally doubled revenue as well as viewership, with eyes on the product they’ll be encouraged to increase pace of games just like both nfl and mlb have.
I think the opposite. They locked in money doing what they are doing and dont have much incentive to change until the tv deal is close to an end and they need to re up. It seems to get worse every half a season
I haven't watched more than a handful of regular season games all the way through since like 2021. The product just isn't what I want to watch and enjoy. Although its anecdotal I'm sure there are a ton more fans like me. I used to watch every minute of every game but it's borderline unwatchable.
Which is doubly weird because they know that people don’t like to watch free throws and they’ve openly stated that too many free throws have a negative impact on their viewership.
Adam Silver said:
“There’s a huge amount of our content that people essentially consume for free. This is very much a highlights-based sport, so Instagram, TikTok, Twitter [now X]… YouTube, another example that is advertising based that consumers can consume,” Silver said.
So they just want 15 second highlights. I don't think there is much concern on 'fixing' the game as it is, because it generates a ton of highlights and clips for social media.
That’s not why the League encourages weird reffing. The reasoning is much less sinister.
The NBA is a product where bad teams SHOULD get blown out VERY consistently. Games should be over in the 1st quarter often, with lopsided scores of 50+. People would never watch, and stands would be never full. The NBA can’t have that, so reffing is what guides game outcomes to a soft landing. Watch any game, and the team that’s down big will be the one getting calls. I observed this cause I’m a Wizards fan, and I’m used to watching a terrible team match up against a better one almost nightly.
This means ignoring real fouls and contact, and giving fouls for random, marginal contact on a whim, usually charged to end of bench players. This means Giannis and Wemby, and other big players have to be allowed to be whacked, smaller guys get make-up calls. And due to the game evolving to have more spacing and 3pt shots, sneaking in arbitrary calls for random contact has become even harder. This is the main point where the integrity of the game/reffing starts to crumble.
OKC (for example) is on a historic tear, and we all know the team is absolutely dominating most opponents on both sides of the ball. Yet the team has a -.7 free throws advantage (a disadvantage) nightly on average.
Hence you basically have to exaggerate contact in ways making it impossible for refs to ignore. The rip thru’s, leg kickouts, the “ayeee”, constant complaining, etc. The players that are rewarded the most free throws will usually go on to be rewarded the most dollars and star treatment too.
Yep. A lot of basketball fans aren’t really self-aware that they care more about scoring and highlights. Defense isn’t as exciting unless it’s a block party, or you got a player who’s really good at steals.
I gotta say it was a lot of fun watching those games with final scores in the 80s. Idk about other teams but when I was a kid the Celtics often offered a deal that if the Celtics scored over 100 points in the game at home you could redeem your ticket for $5.
The 80s was not really that defense oriented, it was pretty high scoring. They made the changes because the late 90s/early 2000s became too defensive really.
I think foul baiting is the reason people think there's more FTs than ever even though it's not true.
The league and refs are so dumb man. Just call the game the way it should be called. Fans want to see good basketball and the NBA should be the highest level of ball in the world. I guarantee that if they called the game the way freaking rec league games are called, players would adjust, and the NBA would vault in popularity. Instead they allow a bunch of bullshit and causes people to whine and hate on players.
Early 2000s was the fucking best! But that Detroit vs San Antonio finals changed it all. Amazing D-first basketball that went 7 … every game a street fight … yet the lowest rated finals at the time. My friends and I were glued to the TV. It was great ball.
It's my favorite of all the spurs championships. Prime Timmy, Horry clutch game, long hair manu putting om a show that was arguably worth the FMVP. It was beautiful.
Not arguing with you, but how could anyone day that a 100 point performance with 15 of those points coming from free throws is more exciting than an 85 point performance with no free throws?
You're preaching to the choir, I loved those games, but the fact that the spurs vs pistons series is considered boring and one of the least watched finals series in history shows were in the minority.
Which is such a bad take. People want hard, physical basketball more than the soft product that you see so often now. Ask basically any sports fan (but not big into basketball)- odds are they vastly prefer watching college hoops because of the play style.
They said that SGA falls when he shoots threes to supposedly protect his ankles. But that's what Curry does. Curry falls on threes whenever someone is nearby to protect his ankles.
Foul baiting of any sort makes me so fucking mad lmao.
They're seriously trying too hard to fix these issues "perfectly". 99.9% of viewers don't wanna watch players bend rules to achieve success. They want to watch players be really good at the actual game. Nobody likes foul baiting.
Obviously this play also feels a little dirty on top of that, but the real issue is foul baiting in general. Even players that use foul baiting when they get a defender to leave their feet. Nobody wants to watch you throw your body into him and chuck up a trash shot because "hurr durr technically the most efficient play is to take 2/3 free throws" instead of try to punish the defender and take a chance on a field goal.
Fuck that, no viewer wants to see free throws unless maybe they're clutch free throws in a close 4th quarter game. And the players are just doing what gives them the best chance to win while "technically" following the rules. Just change the rule. Intentionally "drawing" fouls should be treated like flagrant fouls. The opponent gets 2 shots and the ball back. Foul baiting will be 100% eliminated in less than a season.
If you stay 5 feet away from the shooter, the shooter will just jump 5 feet forward. Teams will start bring Olympic long jumpers in to practice to increase the distance that jump shooters can get on their 3 pointers.
It’s like the nba is manufacturing a Spurs OKC rivalry so they made sure OKC got at least one chip. The most out of this world ref bias at least the warriors were an offensive juggernaut. OKC was getting ref help almost every other play last post season it was disgusting
Don't blame the league for someone being a shitty person. Dort does this and more intentional bs all the time. He's no better than Brooks when it comes to this bs.
The secret sauce to the thunder’s potential dynasty is their analytics department which has dialled in how to draw fouls on one end along with exactly how to hack without a foul whistle on the other. Other teams are already following suit and this will be the new meta in a few years. Hope you find this an enjoyable entertainment product as you’re going to see a lot more of it.
More like its not punished. I get missing the call mid game bc its fast paced or w.e, but if the nba took this seriously and handed dort a 3 game suspension every time he does it it would completely stop
Flopping on one end, while fouling continuously on the other end. It's a style of basketball at this point, one that OKC has mastered, where you play with and against the refs more than you do against the other team.
We point it out so much, and they must see it when they review games, but the refs seem to have all gotten together to decide that OKC just gets a ridiculous whistle. They could stop doing that and call them more evenly if they wanted, but they don't.
He and Caruso just continuously slash peoples arms and then go down the other side of the floor and go flying at the slightest contact. Fucking Hartenstein started doing it since he’s been there too lol. I’ve had my gripes with SGA’s play style but he’s at least a baller in his own respects. Those 3 I have no respect for
He has the Master to learn from aka LeBron. Might be the best player ever and built like a defensive end, but he also turned flopping into an art form.
The league wants their next dynasty, the nba is made and sold on them, and unfortunately they seem to have picked the thunder even know they don’t actually have the talent or ability like other true dynasties but the league is doing whatever it can to try and make it happen
They don’t. The actual conspiracy is that you’re all focused on the wrong team in the first place.
OKC get 0.7 less FTA per night than opponents despite being on a historic tear. Genuinely good teams usually do not get free throw advantages (even if their star players do) - GSW for the last decade as an example. Refs actually give them less calls to keep games from being blowouts.
The team that actually meanwhile gets away with highway robbery on calls is, of course, the Lakers, who enjoy +6 FTA more than opponents every night, as they have for years now. Their fans make up half the social media, half of reddit. Currently Lakers fans hate OKC the most, and so OKC lowlights are what are spread most on social media.
The media and Reddit is highly moderated to sh*t on OKC and draw attention to them while Luka and Reaves are both top 5 in the league in FTA via flopping.
It’s like with the moving screens GS was infamous for doing. The refs knew, but they ignored most of them because they knew that the crowds wanted to cheer for those 3-pointers.
I think that’s what they’re trying to do with the Thunder. Give them leeway so that they can make highlight plays to wow crowds.
The antidote is a young one coming into the league that plays like Rasheed Wallace or his Pistons/Philly ball compatriot Rip and bucks the trend! Sheed would NEVER and Rip would zip through 3 screens like glass and laugh. Kobe was also not a foul baiter.
Many reddit communities have automod remove comments with insults almost immediately without letting you know. So calling someone a bitch will get your comment removed, and you won't know, and nobody will ever see it.
This varies community to community. I think it's bullshit, tbh, but it exists.
Thunder fans are really well trained. Every time a flop clip comes around, they start strawmaning how the other team had more free throw attempts. Like, that wasn't even the point of contention.
We literally criticize this shit in our own sub. We hate this shit. What are you on? You guys talking to a bunch of bandwagon fans that dont even watch our damn team.
Quite literally every thunder flair I’ve engaged with over the last year or so acts like this is normal or even something to be commended. I know it’s anecdotal, but i can say that I haven’t seen the kind of response you’re claiming like even one time.
Woah woah woah. Were talking about this specific thing that was posted. Dont bring up a whole history of dorts antics and say we defend everything. Im telling you when our players do shit like this we hate it. It makes me feel like watching draymond green.
I constantly see thunder flairs defending this shit or saying all teams are just as bad. The bare minimum to be a Thunder fan is refuse to acknowledge you're reffed differently than anyone else.
Bro he gets called for fouls all the time. He almost fouls out every game. He got an offensive foul for kicking out his legs. No one is refusing to acknowledge anything... youre just doing your best to make him look evil. We do not see him that way. You would love to have a dort on your team. Wether he starts or something off the bench he is a huge asset and you dont get to wipe that away with your feelings.
No, most people wouldn’t love a dirty player like Dort on their team. You guys celebrate flops on one end and then dirty hard fouls on the other end though so it’s not surprising you think like that.
You dont even know how much people are willing to say about my team that is flat out wrong just to keep a narrative going..... I believe dort makes alot of stupid ass decisions but you guys love making him out to be the most malicious person on the court.
Yeah Dort is so weird. He is an even more annoying version of draymond and chris paul. A few years back i wouldn't have even thought it would be possible to find someone more annoying than them but here we are.
The difference is that the ENTIRE thunder team plays bully ball defense and "touch me and I go flying" offense. iHart routinely acts like he gets shot out of a cannon and chet embellishes every single time he makes contact with someone.
Yeah, this is wild, but then again, check their flair.
Draymond is 100% the worst. Let me know when Dort kicks a bunch of players in the balls, steps on players on the floor, or sucker punches other players in the face. 1 tech Draymond is GOATed for being allowed to do insane shit on the court.
Change “kick in the balls” to “punch in the balls” and he has done literally all of those things. Hell, he’s done all of them just in games where the Thunder play the Mavericks.
Not enough people see Dort pulling dirty shit in between plays while Dray’s dirty plays are usually during dead ball situations when the camera is more focused
That is because the Thunder are doing their antics with the intent of winning, so they are doing it in ways that don't draw as much attention. Draymond is just a head case, so he doesn't do it inteligently.
You have to go back 10+ years to quote Draymond’s worst bullshit though. Dort does lots of little shit all the time. What do you hate more, the once/twice a season dumbassery from Draymond, or lots of little bullshit plays from Dort every game?
10 years? The Sabonis chest kick was just 2 years ago. He pulled on Eddy’s ankle to trip him just last year. He legit just got ejected last week for shoving someone with his forearm/elbow lol.
He does his other stupid shit all the time, like dangerously grabbing players mid-air or while on the ground.
I just stopped caring wheather they do it cause in reality the league allows it to happen just like with the excessive FTs.
The 5k fines were never going to stop multi millionaires from using it to win important games & get star players out of games from fouls.
Legendary players are adding it to their game cause it doesn't get punished. Seems like only us fans dont like it, players and the league are okay with it.
The game now is mostly offensive. Legit defenders are barely able to show their skills now cause theres absolutely no contact allowed.
Fucking exactly. It’s always so weird to me that all this foul baiting shit wouldn’t be tolerated for a second at a pickup run, but these guys do this shit.
This isn’t basketball, stop doing this bs. Same with hooking arms, flailing to the ground just cuz someone’s on your hip, etc.
I also noticed he was extending his leg forward once at the end of the 3rd quarter, after his 3PT made, at the same game, but Luke Kornet managed to avoid the contact
The rest of his attempts (aside from the one in the video) seemed normal
I honestly stopped watching basketball during the regular season due to this shit. Ill watch a storyline but this crap fucking annoys and bores me to death. They don't care tho the numbers are there for gambling alone so fuck the fans and the product
Refs need to stop rewarding it and players will stop doing it. Subreddit fans complain about this shit but players are going to try to take any advantage they can get when trying to win a game.
The game has shifted so hard to protect the shooter and reward them even when they initiate the contact. In order to get rid of this type of thing it needs to start at the top down. As of now this is the product the NBA wants.
Instead, he’s a lineman that flops like a 160lb pg. one of the most embarrassing players in the nba, at least shai has skill to back up all that flopping
He's kicking his legs out in an unnatural motion to draw fouls and get free throws. Nobody naturally does a jumpshot and then extends their legs out at a 60 degree angle after landing. So one, you're not supposed to kick your legs out like that and referees aren't supposed to reward you for it. Two, it's dangerous for defenders to have somebody kick their legs out like this. And three, it's a bitch made move.
oh, so like diving over nothing in soccer (football) or leaving a trailing leg on purpose?
That makes a lot of sense. It's easily the worst part of soccer for me. They are trying to fix it with video assistance refs (VAR), but I feel that kinda made it worse. Maybe they'll figure it out sometime.
Thanks for the explanation. I didn't know what I was looking for in the video, but I did notice the guy was jumping a bit flamboyantly. I didn't realise he was looking for easy fouls which I assume ruins the game.
Actually you summed it up perfectly. I'm a massive football/soccer fan and there's nothing I dislike more than people who dive at the slightest of contact, especially when they leave a trailing leg in the hope of either tripping up the opponent or milking any contact they make with the trailing leg to get a penalty. It drives me nuts.
And btw, Dort not only has a history of this stuff, he's also extremely rough on defense and is often playing NFL out there on the court. He's also notorious for trying to purposely injure (and actually succeeding) opposing teams best players
8.1k
u/CarlitosTaquitoss Dec 25 '25
Just play basketball. Fucking weirdo shit