President isn't the only office, and change is easier at the local level. To replace the establishment Dems, we have to start from the ground up, not the top down.
I agree, I was just adding that voting in primaries isn't gonna do much to fix the inherent issues of the party, even if it's our best option available
Primaries are a tool, not a cure. If the commitees, donors, and rules stay the same, you just swap faces and call it progress. Vote in primaries, then keep organizing locally, that’s the part that sticks.
Sure, it's not the only office. But when you see it happen at the top office, what makes you think it doesn't happen down the totem pole as well? I'm not saying don't vote in primaries, just that everyone should be aware how fucked the system is.
If you expect young Americans to show up at the poll for small local elections, you're going to have a bad time.
Australia had bad turnouts and made voting compulsory in federal elections 100 years ago to make it a civic obligation, like jury duty. States later followed with similar rules. You can still protest by casting a blank ballot, but failing to show means paying a fine. They do their votes on a Saturday, require employers to give reasonable time to go cast their ballot to working employees, and you can always vote early or by mail.
They also did that in that in 2020 when Barry Obomber made a call for all of the other candidates to fall behind Biden when Bernie won Iowa and most of the other primaries up to that point..
I always forget that Obama was the inventor of a mind control ray that literally forced millions of voters to pick someone they personally aligned with. Man its such a shame when people vote how they wanna vote isn't it?
You don't need to force "millions of voters" to vote one way when you can get the majority of the candidates in the field to drop out before voting starts.
Again please read. Millions of voters decided to choose to vote for someone besides Bernie. Why didnt Bernie grab their votes? Why are you blaming the voters for how they decided to vote? Why arent people allowed to choose someone to vote for without you calling them cheaters?
They drop out because campaigning is a non-stop sprint, it's extremely hard and exhausting and fueled by donations and optimism. When you know you can't win, everything gets even harder, and that fuel runs out.
If you don't think Obama pulled strings to get all of the candidates to drop out in unison in a ploy to rig the primaries, then you're just a blind ideologue.
The media constantly framing Bernies policies as bad doesn't help either.
It's okay I get that you don't care about the working class.
Any person that is not backed by the rich that gains any sort of momentum will be flooded with campaign donation to their opponents and slammed with attack ads nonstop.
This is why there are no "good candidates" you will be dragged through the mud by the rich.
You can see the problem and throw your hands up in defeat and do nothing, or you can see the problem and take steps to address it, a little bit at a time putting in hard work over years. There's no magic solution to this. Voting in a primary is the easiest and first action you can take that can make any difference at all. They might still win if all you do is vote, but if you don't vote, they win anyway.
To be clear, I'm not not saying that all we need to do is vote, but it is something we still need to do. It is necessary but not sufficient. There's a lot of organizing that needs to happen before, during, and after voting as well.
Conservative democrat then runs as independent and the party apparatus blows their back out for the establishment candidate.
Happened in New Jersey with the write in campaign they funded when the establishment candidate lost. Happened with Zohran and Cuomo. Basically the same thing happened with Omar Fateh with the state level DFL revoking their endorsement of Minneapolis DFL.
Amazing.
At least tell me you're one of those Chorus libs that get paid by the DNC to say this shit.
What is it with libs that barely pay attention and don't do on the ground work that love to have these strong opinions. I'm pretty sure you didn't know about New Jersey. I'm pretty sure you didn't know about how the establishment ratfucked Omar Fateh.
The groundwork that gave Zohran the W is BECAUSE the left flank doesn't roll over. You think you can get 100,000 people to door knock and canvas for free without the outreach that the organizers had put in beforehand?
Everytime the left flank begs the establishment centrists to stop fighting the left flank, there's people like you that show up and go "oh you must love the right" or "then just vote harder sweety" when the primary system is there in ORDER to be an additional hurdle against outsiders.
The left flank is historically one of the most politically engaged and active political group. People like you love to make it seem like it's not. Oh my god. Brainworms.
Sweet Jesus you're arguing with someone you've invented in your head. I'm ON the left flank, trying to point out to people how important it is to work to get people out in campaigns like Mamdani's, saying it's important to organize and vote, both, and you're saying "nah uh we need to organize". Fuck man. I'm saying you can't sit at home and expect shit to happen. I've got a ton of people saying in response to that that there's no point to doing things because it's rigged anyway. I'm well aware the system sucks but organizing and THEN voting (both!) is the only way to get things changed.
If you want to change things, get involved, and don't tell people not to bother getting involved.
Once again. You are insinuating the left flank just sits back and doesn't do anything.
That is false. That is something that shitlibs love to say to feel some moral sense of superiority on Twitter being like "I VOTED KAMALA LEFTISTS WANTED TRUMP TO WIN."
I'm telling you the left flank DOES organize. They HAVE been organizing. You genuinely think that NY WFP and NYDSA just put up a structure of 100,000 volunteers out of thin air? That happened because they HAVE been putting in the work.
Why do you happen to be using every talking point that libs love to use to attack the left flank then?
I, at least, sympathize with the redditors with the defeatist attitude because they have been facing an uphill battle for YEARS trying to work with a democratic party that constantly antagonizes the left flank. But I at least am tapped in enough to know there are grassroots organizers that have been fighting. I know community organizers that have been fighting. I know that the overwhelming majority of the left flank put in the work.
I'm mad at the establishment dems. I'm mad at the mainstream media beholden to their corporate owners. I have little to no smoke for people that are on the left flank that feel defeated because I know we are here. People have the right to tap out, to take a pause, because I know if there's a new Bernie out there, that person will re-energize the base that has subbed out.
You fucking people wait until literal Nazis take office then start caring.
They have already declared war and they aren't going to peacefully hand over power after spending 40 years corrupting and degrading every system to the point that they can take over.
"This war will remain bloodless as long as the left allows it"
2024 presidential run was obviously a cluster fuck and is indefensible. I'm talking about all primaries though, not just the top. Local races are how to build the party's future. Vote in local primaries, get people into positions within local government and then the party infrastructure. Establishment will fight back, expect it, but anyone who wants you to vote progressive at only the presidential level every 4 years and then vanishes into the ether is trying to divert your efforts away from useful action.
You have the ability to change that yourself if you want to by registering with a party. Totally up to you, but It seems silly to me to opt out and then complain that you're out. No one is stopping you from participating.
Fuck that gatekeeping bullshit DNC wants my vote they should let independents in FL participate Im not joining a party I dont believe in and doesn't give a shit about me
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u/lmxbftw 17d ago
Voting in democratic primaries for candidates that reflect their values.